[Algore]

Originally Posted by Tesrend

Honestly,

A game mechanic that might have helped a bit would simply have been tracking Civ kills and HG kills seperately and listing them on the stat page seperately.

-Tez

Something I have been wanting for years tbh. I have 10 civ rips/demerits in 9 years.
I'd love to see what this separation in statistics would have shown that I already know about other PvP'ers approach to the game

Self policing didn't work, get over it.

Al

[GrimGriz]

Originally Posted by Ambrosius

Self-policing is a much better solution.

Then make it work. The only consequence of a pvper getting bored and ripping a civ was that they got attention/pvp...which is a reward for the bored.

[Ambrosius]

Self-policing DID work. It didn't provide perfect protection -- but it did effectively limit the civving (since bad guys had to spend some amount of time running away) -- which kept the game interesting for the muggers, the police and the would-be victims (Jumpgate would be ridiculously dull without "muggers").

[-=TheWolf=-]

As a new player to this game I would like to give each faction a try equally to find out which one I like the most. But thats my newbie 2 cents.

[ELPIRATA]

Safezones aren't about keeping the asshats safe, they're about keeping the asshats from harassing people

We do know what ND's safezones want them to be, but we see past that and we know that a measure like that will also protect them asshats which is what this issue is about, if they are safe inside them there's nothing we can do to take them out. I wasnt thinking much about The Borg since I dont remember they jumping unreg/reg to use game mechanics to their favor, but Balrog did, and this is what I'm afraid the most, game mechanics once again protecting the ones is NOT supposed to protect.

To me, if ND allows PvP squads to fight as they used to (even in Core stations) and as long a measure is set in place to allow us to hunt/kill the asshats... then there wont be a real need for a PvP server, I mean, it would be possible to 'live' on the PvE server.

[GrimGriz]

Originally Posted by Ambrosius

Self-policing DID work. It didn't provide perfect protection -- but it did effectively limit the civving (since bad guys had to spend some amount of time running away) -- which kept the game interesting for the muggers, the police and the would-be victims (Jumpgate would be ridiculously dull without "muggers").

I think it's more dull without the fluxxers, miners, and other sector traffic

[Ambrosius]

The difference is I'm trying to be serious, and you're just trying to be contrary.

[Tim]

At the risk of sounding contrary, I think that if self-policing worked, it would have worked in Jumpgate v.1.

All the elements were there. Open combat, anywhere, anytime. Squads of people claiming to want to RP. People being asshats. It was all in the mix.

But I very clearly recall a significant portion of people leaving because of asshats. Hell, i'm one of them. I know this makes me a horrible, horrible person, but I'm in favor of a relaxing game that doesn't require a lot of dedicated time in order to have a bit of fun. (My job, family, friends, and life away from the computer get in the way of manifesting the addiction that would be necessary for me to spend days on end circling around the same target).

For purposes of disclosure, and to speed the conversation along, I've already been told in many ways and in many places that if I don't like the self-policing, anything goes atmosphere of Jumpgate, then I should just move on. So I did. I took the advice, and don't play anymore.

If jumpgate evolution learns something from Jumpgate 1, then I'll be back. Jumpgate let pilots do whatever, wherever. Lets see what happens when they try something different.

[Ratneck]

Originally Posted by Tim

At the risk of sounding contrary, I think that if self-policing worked, it would have worked in Jumpgate v.1.

All the elements were there. Open combat, anywhere, anytime. Squads of people claiming to want to RP. People being asshats. It was all in the mix.

But I very clearly recall a significant portion of people leaving because of asshats. Hell, i'm one of them. I know this makes me a horrible, horrible person, but I'm in favor of a relaxing game that doesn't require a lot of dedicated time in order to have a bit of fun. (My job, family, friends, and life away from the computer get in the way of manifesting the addiction that would be necessary for me to spend days on end circling around the same target).

For purposes of disclosure, and to speed the conversation along, I've already been told in many ways and in many places that if I don't like the self-policing, anything goes atmosphere of Jumpgate, then I should just move on. So I did. I took the advice, and don't play anymore.

If jumpgate evolution learns something from Jumpgate 1, then I'll be back. Jumpgate let pilots do whatever, wherever. Lets see what happens when they try something different.

The problem is that you can't claim PvE vs. PvP will be the reason more people stick around in Jumpgate Evolution. There were plenty of reasons to leave jumpgate other then asshats. A non-exhaustive list:

1) You really NEEDED a joystick (I know, some people are just as good with mouse and keyboard, but not most) if you wanted to be competative. Joysticks are not an accessory most people own.

2) There weren't many people playing.

3) There was only one facet to the game, pew-pew. There was no "real" economy to speak of.

4) Sci-Fi games are a smaller genre then fantasy....making the game a flight sim chokes this number down even more. Not being a previously established IP makes it even tougher.

5) MMO's didn't boom till well after Jumpgate came out. (I think Jumpgate was my second MMO, after Ultima Online, and all I did in that game was dress up in red with a bunch of friends, sit in a chair, and sell poision to people telling them it was healing potions.)

I would love it if we could all get along on one server. I just don't see it happening. You're going to have the people who just want to grind stuff PvE wise and don't want to deal with PvP...but they want to be able to sell to the PvP market since it's a money sink. You're going to have PvP players who don't want their enemy to be able to use a "protected" area or be able to purchase supplies from protected people because those are cheap tactics that can't be faught in-game.

If they want to maximize the subscriptions, I think they need to have a PvE server with people who just want to play against NPC's. Put in a dynamic system to populate the NPC's based on player vs player kills in a system. This way the PvE server will be populated it with an extra large number of NPC's since no one gets killed by other players. The PvP server will still have NPC's to fight, but it will be less where the "action" is...thus NPC's won't be bugging people who want to fight each other.

The big question is, will the core subscriber base be large enough to support two servers? If not, which type of play will bring in more money at the start...and which will stick around longer. It's got to be a business decision based on whatever statistics they can glean from other MMO's, they can't base it on things like forum polls or the IRC channel that 10 or 15 people chat in.

[netburnr]

Ratneck, you do not NEED a joystick, there were pilots that could whip anyone's butt and they used mice..... Most of em were quants though, weirdos.....

[Ratneck]

Originally Posted by netburnr

Ratneck, you do not NEED a joystick, there were pilots that could whip anyone's butt and they used mice..... Most of em were quants though, weirdos.....

Originally Posted by Ratneck

1) You really NEEDED a joystick (I know, some people are just as good with mouse and keyboard, but not most) if you wanted to be competative. Joysticks are not an accessory most people own.

I know. There are exceptions to every rule. The people who were good with kb and mouse stuck around. Those who weren't got frustrated and left I would assume. It took patience and love to get good with a keyboard and mouse, most MMOers don't have those two things. But mom's cookies do!