When do you think GMs should intervene?

GrimGriz · 03:48 PM

For example, with the situation that the -Cobra- account has created, when should GMs intervene?

I don't know exactly what this person has been up to, but apparently he's distressed and made the game unfun for a number of players. I'm not sure if he's civving people in reg, unreg, or fluxspace, or whether the rumors of him collecting his own bounty are true or not.

Should the GMs do anything? If so, when? Should we have to write an e-mail to the GMs every time we rip a civ explaining the RP validity of it (i heard it was like that on EU)? Does the server even record data enough that the GMs can investigate allegations of harassment/whatever without just taking the word of the players? I'd really hate for Algore to be able to send an e-mail to the GMs saying I was doing nefarious things and be banned for something untrue.

So, when should GMs intervene, what should the intervention be? How should things work? What's y'all's opinion on the subject?

vorlon31

GM's should monitor bounties - who gets them, from what squad and act when a trend starts to show, pref before the situation gets to the point when people say ENOUGH!

Macdonalds staff throw unrully customers out if they start misbehaving, for the good of the majority (and profit). Is Jumpgate that much different to a burger? Its still a product, its still addictive and is still the best in its class.

And a GM should be in game too, making sure the rules are followed and the customers are happy.

BTW, I hate civ killing. TRI weapons should only work on TRI ships HGvHG and for 60 seconds after a jump to reg space and flux space should never have been unregulated in the forst place - damn the RP reasons for making it greifer town.

Bounties should only be aquired through piracy with burglars (fly in, nick the cargo and legit), not rips on miners and non pvp'rs.

Wild_Bill

I'm conflicted on this issue from a number of different directions. I *HATE* being civ'd to the extent that at the time of the attack I was mining, or hauling or fluxing or basically minding my own darned business and get an unasked for pod ride. If I'm in a combat ship, I'm still not happy about the pod ride, but at least I had the option of fighting back.

On the other hand, if all it takes to get banned is the comments of a bunch of other people, then I'm against that too. Of course, if you are or have been carrying a bunch of bounties, then it's obvious I've been doing SOMETHING naughty.

There should be some kind of bounty program for civ-rips that works on a sliding scale. If you only civ'd 1 person a year or so, the current model is fine. One a month and it should be VERY stiff penalites to discourage such unsocial activity. When it gets past that point, the player doing the civ-rips should have to explain him or herself and defend the validity of their actions both to the GMs and to the community at large.

The fact you are not HG, or are otherwise civilian registered, should not ALWAYS protect you from aggression. ICA = ICC. Bad mouthing a PvPer should NEVER be a safe practice. Calling location or position on a PvP squad on a public channel is nearly always going to have negative consequencies down stream.

Balrog has civ'd me in unreg (docking at Evenings End station) without warning or comment before or after. Cobra was present but not involved. I've got nothing to say on this one, any more than I did when UB was active. I was one of their "victims" but it was withing their RP as it was unreg and I had a choice. Same for THE BORG. I don't/didn't like those squads and I certainly don't mind their abscence, but they at least stuck within their RP.

If Cobra is guilty of what he's been accused of (and I have no real reason to doubt the reports), then he should be banned because he is taking the fun out of the game for a lot of people. That should be a major determinant; when one pilot's actions have such a negative affect on other pilots that the victims start quitting.

Algore · 03:48 PM

@GG
There is no f'ing capital "G" in my name.
I'm a pretty bad example baring in mind I get banned every time I tell the truth.
If he got banned for cheating the bounty system then cool. If he got banned for a few civ rips then it's out of order.
Eitherway I couldn't really give a flying f'

Regards
Al

edit:
fatal typo

Hawlk

Jumpgate has taken a turn for the worse if he was really banned for civ'ing. I saw him flying a bunch of times and never saw a bounty, But I have not been on in like about a week so don't know if things got out of hand at the end. Civ ripping is bad but if you go into unreg or flux space the game warns you that you are about to enter unregulated teritory. I think the GM's need to relook at the bounty system quickly. I can't believe you get PR points for dieing when you are bountied. What about crashing. I mean get into a premia and hit the station 10 times and poof no more bounty. That would be really sad. I think a lot of people just went over board on this, but then again maybe I will be getting my favorite game back and never have to worry about PVpers again.

GrimGriz

Allowing for civving allows for harassment, and since there is money involved the harassment has to be kept in check. Hopefully, keeping it in check won't require eliminating the freedom of the occasional civ rip.

Argyris

I'd hate not to be able to civrip you, GG, when you are painting oct space to the wrong colour, trying to claim the bty of a fellow oct who just prevented someone from doing that. (Which would be the result of vorlons suggestion, if I got that right)

edit: does this actually make any sense? :P

SingleShot

Banning for cheesing off some carebears with a couple civ rips is way out of line.

Not that they necessarily did it. Banning for bounty exploiting is a-ok.

etc, etc.

QrazyKermi

The Themis GM's should take a hand-off approach. I mean a REALLY hands-off, like hands off the keyboard, hands off the phone calls from Netdevil trying to renew their contract with them, hands of their handbook "Zen and the art of being a <male appendage>".

Then the player base would grow, many vets would return, and the playerbase would take care of these problems by themselves. And I'd finally get to sell that bridge I've been trying to unload for a while.

Nohbody

Because, of course, we all know what a stellar job Jumpgate did in retaining players after 3DO packed up, and ND was not only the development team but also the customer support one...

Mind you, the notion that Themis is the only CS team that screws up in the entire MMOG world is rather amusing, in an OMGWTFBBQ manner.

Corn

honestly if they banned Cobra for civ ripping i'd be extremely angered. IF they ban him for explotation of bounty system then good ridance. I also think dieing should not be an option for working off bounties although i think in doing that bounties would become even more difficult to collect.

As much as everyone (carebears) dislike being killed its part of the game. Occasionally thier is going to be some Asswipe that is going to down you while your not even paying attention, FOR NO REASON. Quitting the game over it is like handing the "win" over to cobra, quiting Jumpgate is not going to change GM minds on this subject, nor mine. I hate to see people quit over such minute reasons.

I don't understand how being shot down on several occasion by 1 pilot could make a whole squad quit the game. I think this really sucks, i by no means agree with cobras RP, but i understand it. This is just another case of his RP is griefing my RP. WELL SUCK IT UP. I know that cobra has allready left a foul taste in my mouth and i shoot at him regardless of location or tags. Everyone in game has acsess to ONLINE PILOTS, my suggestion is instead of handing out the "win" by quiting; (and really cutting of your own nose to spite your face) That when you see this pilot online group together and actively hunt them, get an f5 started with some of the quant factionalist(cause lets face it, were they only ones left standing up for the common fluxer or econ worker) and start your own griefage of cobra. Just remember in the end it is only game, and if a single player's action cause you so much grief and stress that you decide to quit than maybe a break is in order, or maybe picking up mario brothers and remember why you started playing games in the first place...........to have fun.

cheese anyone?

EDIT: well anyways from the looks of things cobra is TRIC, hope all is well now

Tim

hahahahaha

OMFGWTFBBQ ????

That's funny stuff right there.

hahahahah

(oh, and it's good to see nothing changes in good 'ol Jumpgate. It'd be interesting if one of the stat-whores were to look up how many names (from the past 4 or so years) could be used in place of "Cobra" in this thread, and then compare the length of _that_ list to the list of online pilots. )

Still, I really wish Idaho would let me use OMGWTFBBQ for a motorcycle license plate...

TRI Pilots On Duty
On Duty:	33
In Flight:	21
Solrain:	5
Octavius:	12
Quantar:	16
TRI:	0

Category	Pilot	Score
Kills	Algore	2,742
Kill Ratio*	_KROM_	470.000 %
Bounty Collected	Killntime	407,838,097
Munitions Accuracy*	Psycho	85.915 %
Projectile Accuracy*	Psycho	96.774 %
Total Conflux Kills	vorlon31	148,595
Experience	CaptainCow	100,000,000
Mission Success Ratio*	Arkady	100 %
Insurance Rating*	Knork	10 %
Net Worth	McPlowed	c22,063,537,526
Duty Hours	RedDwarf	16,920.2
*minimum requirements to qualify


	GrimGriz Highest Order Hypocrite Faction: non-aligned Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Portland Posts: 2,648	When do you think GMs should intervene? For example, with the situation that the -Cobra- account has created, when should GMs intervene? I don't know exactly what this person has been up to, but apparently he's distressed and made the game unfun for a number of players. I'm not sure if he's civving people in reg, unreg, or fluxspace, or whether the rumors of him collecting his own bounty are true or not. Should the GMs do anything? If so, when? Should we have to write an e-mail to the GMs every time we rip a civ explaining the RP validity of it (i heard it was like that on EU)? Does the server even record data enough that the GMs can investigate allegations of harassment/whatever without just taking the word of the players? I'd really hate for Algore to be able to send an e-mail to the GMs saying I was doing nefarious things and be banned for something untrue. So, when should GMs intervene, what should the intervention be? How should things work? What's y'all's opinion on the subject?
		Last edited by GrimGriz; 11-29-2005 at 03:48 PM.


	vorlon31 Member Faction: non-aligned Joystick: Saitek EVO Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 832	GM's should monitor bounties - who gets them, from what squad and act when a trend starts to show, pref before the situation gets to the point when people say ENOUGH! Macdonalds staff throw unrully customers out if they start misbehaving, for the good of the majority (and profit). Is Jumpgate that much different to a burger? Its still a product, its still addictive and is still the best in its class. And a GM should be in game too, making sure the rules are followed and the customers are happy. BTW, I hate civ killing. TRI weapons should only work on TRI ships HGvHG and for 60 seconds after a jump to reg space and flux space should never have been unregulated in the forst place - damn the RP reasons for making it greifer town. Bounties should only be aquired through piracy with burglars (fly in, nick the cargo and legit), not rips on miners and non pvp'rs.


	Wild_Bill Member Pilot Name: Wild_Bill Faction: Octavius Joystick: MS Sidewinder Precision Plus Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Abilene Texas Posts: 795	I'm conflicted on this issue from a number of different directions. I HATE being civ'd to the extent that at the time of the attack I was mining, or hauling or fluxing or basically minding my own darned business and get an unasked for pod ride. If I'm in a combat ship, I'm still not happy about the pod ride, but at least I had the option of fighting back. On the other hand, if all it takes to get banned is the comments of a bunch of other people, then I'm against that too. Of course, if you are or have been carrying a bunch of bounties, then it's obvious I've been doing SOMETHING naughty. There should be some kind of bounty program for civ-rips that works on a sliding scale. If you only civ'd 1 person a year or so, the current model is fine. One a month and it should be VERY stiff penalites to discourage such unsocial activity. When it gets past that point, the player doing the civ-rips should have to explain him or herself and defend the validity of their actions *both to the GMs and to the community at large*. The fact you are not HG, or are otherwise civilian registered, should not ALWAYS protect you from aggression. ICA = ICC. Bad mouthing a PvPer should NEVER be a safe practice. Calling location or position on a PvP squad on a public channel is nearly always going to have negative consequencies down stream. Balrog has civ'd me in unreg (docking at Evenings End station) without warning or comment before or after. Cobra was present but not involved. I've got nothing to say on this one, any more than I did when UB was active. I was one of their "victims" but it was withing their RP as it was unreg and I had a choice. Same for THE BORG. I don't/didn't like those squads and I certainly don't mind their abscence, but they at least stuck within their RP. If Cobra is guilty of what he's been accused of (and I have no real reason to doubt the reports), then he should be banned because he is taking the fun out of the game for a lot of people. That should be a major determinant; when one pilot's actions have such a negative affect on other pilots that the victims start quitting.


	Algore Member Pilot Name: Algore Joystick: MS Force Feedback 2 Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Belfast. Northern Ireland Posts: 558	@GG There is no f'ing capital "G" in my name. I'm a pretty bad example baring in mind I get banned every time I tell the truth. If he got banned for cheating the bounty system then cool. If he got banned for a few civ rips then it's out of order. Eitherway I couldn't really give a flying f' Regards Al edit: fatal typo
		Last edited by GrimGriz; 11-29-2005 at 03:48 PM.


	Hawlk Dishonored by GM_K Pilot Name: Hawlk Joystick: Saitek Cyborg 3D Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Fontana, CA Posts: 49	Jumpgate has taken a turn for the worse if he was really banned for civ'ing. I saw him flying a bunch of times and never saw a bounty, But I have not been on in like about a week so don't know if things got out of hand at the end. Civ ripping is bad but if you go into unreg or flux space the game warns you that you are about to enter unregulated teritory. I think the GM's need to relook at the bounty system quickly. I can't believe you get PR points for dieing when you are bountied. What about crashing. I mean get into a premia and hit the station 10 times and poof no more bounty. That would be really sad. I think a lot of people just went over board on this, but then again maybe I will be getting my favorite game back and never have to worry about PVpers again.
		__________________ "because you can't teach someone a brain" - T. Peters - A Great Co-worker talking about a employee at my company.


	Argyris Cadet Pilot Name: Argyris Joystick: Sidewinder FF2 Join Date: May 2005 Location: in the line of fire Posts: 48	I'd hate not to be able to civrip you, GG, when you are painting oct space to the wrong colour, trying to claim the bty of a fellow oct who just prevented someone from doing that. (Which would be the result of vorlons suggestion, if I got that right) edit: does this actually make any sense? :P
		__________________ Anson Argyris Wingman OV


	SingleShot Member Pilot Name: SingleShot Joystick: Spare FF2 Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 471	Banning for cheesing off some carebears with a couple civ rips is way out of line. Not that they necessarily did it. Banning for bounty exploiting is a-ok. etc, etc.
		__________________ Got foon? jgcentral.net is the home of The Brotherhood.


	QrazyKermi Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: CT Posts: 577	The Themis GM's should take a hand-off approach. I mean a REALLY hands-off, like hands off the keyboard, hands off the phone calls from Netdevil trying to renew their contract with them, hands of their handbook "Zen and the art of being a <male appendage>". Then the player base would grow, many vets would return, and the playerbase would take care of these problems by themselves. And I'd finally get to sell that bridge I've been trying to unload for a while.


	Nohbody Kalralahr, The Drakhai Pilot Name: Nohbody Joystick: TM Top Gun Fox2 Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Taylors, SC, USA Posts: 380	Because, of course, we all know what a stellar job Jumpgate did in retaining players after 3DO packed up, and ND was not only the development team but also the customer support one... Mind you, the notion that Themis is the only CS team that screws up in the entire MMOG world is rather amusing, in an OMGWTFBBQ manner.
		__________________ Just another nohbody professional statwh0r3


	Corn Cadet Pilot Name: Corn Faction: None Joystick: X52 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 41	honestly if they banned Cobra for civ ripping i'd be extremely angered. IF they ban him for explotation of bounty system then good ridance. I also think dieing should not be an option for working off bounties although i think in doing that bounties would become even more difficult to collect. As much as everyone (carebears) dislike being killed its part of the game. Occasionally thier is going to be some Asswipe that is going to down you while your not even paying attention, FOR NO REASON. Quitting the game over it is like handing the "win" over to cobra, quiting Jumpgate is not going to change GM minds on this subject, nor mine. I hate to see people quit over such minute reasons. I don't understand how being shot down on several occasion by 1 pilot could make a whole squad quit the game. I think this really sucks, i by no means agree with cobras RP, but i understand it. This is just another case of his RP is griefing my RP. WELL SUCK IT UP. I know that cobra has allready left a foul taste in my mouth and i shoot at him regardless of location or tags. Everyone in game has acsess to ONLINE PILOTS, my suggestion is instead of handing out the "win" by quiting; (and really cutting of your own nose to spite your face) That when you see this pilot online group together and actively hunt them, get an f5 started with some of the quant factionalist(cause lets face it, were they only ones left standing up for the common fluxer or econ worker) and start your own griefage of cobra. Just remember in the end it is only game, and if a single player's action cause you so much grief and stress that you decide to quit than maybe a break is in order, or maybe picking up mario brothers and remember why you started playing games in the first place...........to have fun. cheese anyone? EDIT: well anyways from the looks of things cobra is TRIC, hope all is well now


	Tim Head Goober Joystick: Some 3-axis thing. It's black. Join Date: May 2004 Location: recovering from Naked Volleyball Posts: 789	hahahahaha OMFGWTFBBQ ???? That's funny stuff right there. hahahahah (oh, and it's good to see nothing changes in good 'ol Jumpgate. It'd be interesting if one of the stat-whores were to look up how many names (from the past 4 or so years) could be used in place of "Cobra" in this thread, and then compare the length of _that_ list to the list of online pilots. ) Still, I really wish Idaho would let me use OMGWTFBBQ for a motorcycle license plate...