[GrimGriz]

Originally Posted by netburnrol

Here is my problem. You flip MT, you are now stuck MT until you take a good amount of time (not 30 minutes like courier suggestion TYVM, I just tried it), but at least a good portion of your playtime. So now you can't land at half the stations on the map, including PLAYER (NOT FACTION) OWNED STATION? Seriously, that is just plain stupid. What if after a couple fights I really want some purg missles?

Why WOULD a faction at war with you allow you to dock anywhere in their space? That'd be stupid. Buy your purgs from an octavian arms reseller.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by netburnrol

While I agree with you completely, I do not think this is going to be the answer to the question. ND obviously did not think that would work for Jumpgate Classic, so they added HG, so with that thinking, they are going to want some system for Jumpgate Evolution, lets try to help them think it out here...

Well I don't see any need for tags so rather than help ND come up with a tag-based system let's just convince them that it isn't necessary!

[Tritian]

I agree, no tags would be the ideal way to go.

It would certainly help the game a lot more then segregating the community into this pvp/carebear crap where everyone plays basically a singleplayer game w/ IRC built in.

If you get rid of the tags, you open up the game to a lot more RP potential and people will start relaying on each other more for protection. Which could only be a good thing.

[GrimGriz]

Originally Posted by Tritian

If you get rid of the tags, you open up the game to a lot more RP potential and people will start relaying on each other more for protection. Which could only be a good thing.

And to bring this full circle, the only way that would be okay is if the haulers and miners could defend themselves, ya know, with turrets

[Wild_Bill]

So bring back the HG tags and let's see if that helps or hurts. Use the MT 10 mission requirement just to keep folks honest.

Net, you need anything hauled while you are MT, there are people around who are willing to help... for a price of course (nudge, nudge, wink, wink).

[ELPIRATA]

@Net: One of the ideas of the MT system was that PvPers would be able to make money... whereas before you couldnt (at least not fighting). PvPers making money means they can interact more/better with factional civilians which as pointed before, act as arms resellers and stock stations. PvPers protect their civilians because they keep them stocked and then, voila, perfect world!!!

Of course, there are moments in which this will fail, but a well run squad will have moments scheduled for stocking fighting supplies.

IMO heading into enemy space and getting out is now more of a Feat than it was never before. It would be even better (Im probably alone on this) if POS werent around, so that we dont see the current fights that happen between DG/DR/Stith because its shorter and both enemies have bases over there.

I like the idea of having a pos if Im to exist in a place where no stations are available that cover my needs, but for the most part, Im against POS. Anyways, if ur at war, you can't even dock at public POS in enemy space, its just the whole point.

ELP

[SingleShot]

I can understand why barring MTs from docking at enemy stations is realistic.

But I've never really liked it as a game mechanic. I can understand if it is carried over, but I think if it is there should be some changes relative to Jumpgate Classic, with the big one being lots more "neutral" space & places. (I'm not necessarily saying unreg, just areas that are even handed to both sides). Losing the ability to fight around stations even more than the FF nerf already cost us is not fun, imo. Realistic, though.

[netburnr]

Originally Posted by Wild_Bill

Net, you need anything hauled while you are MT, there are people around who are willing to help... for a price of course (nudge, nudge, wink, wink).

I'll just use what I can find, not that rich

Well maybe I am, I just gave sentinels 10mil for 3 ffs, lol

Originally Posted by ELPIRATA

@Net: One of the ideas of the MT system was that PvPers would be able to make money... whereas before you couldnt (at least not fighting). PvPers making money means they can interact more/better with factional civilians which as pointed before, act as arms resellers and stock stations. PvPers protect their civilians because they keep them stocked and then, voila, perfect world!!!

Well from what I understand the "full" insurance isn't all its cracked up to be. I havn't crunched the numbers, but I've heard it from multiple MT pilots that are on daily. Apparently you still loose money unless you win aloe. I don't know about you, but when you die alot, you can't make the money that your supposedly supposed to make.

And what do civs have to do with the MT tag. From what I've heard the civrip/bounty penalties have been jacked so far up, that there is literally no way to do so and stay in the game after a small amount of deaths. Also no way to work it off at a decent pace so that you can finally have basic insurance again and work your way back up. Its just plain stupid.

Originally Posted by SingleShot

I can understand why barring MTs from docking at enemy stations is realistic.

But I've never really liked it as a game mechanic. I can understand if it is carried over, but I think if it is there should be some changes relative to Jumpgate Classic, with the big one being lots more "neutral" space & places. (I'm not necessarily saying unreg, just areas that are even handed to both sides). Losing the ability to fight around stations even more than the FF nerf already cost us is not fun, imo. Realistic, though.

I think you might have the closest viewpoint that I currenly have. If im correct you are from the era where speeddocking was king, using flees and refreshes and wave attacks to conquer all. This is just plain not possible anymore. The bad guys come, they all die. You wait for them to come back or take it to there side.

There is no speed docking. There is no refreshing. There is no way to keep a heavy battle up for any period of time before the invading side looses all their resources and dies. (at least in teh case of oct since the ships are slower)

My latest gripe.... I have to tie myself into 10 missions if I want to be MT. So now I'm sitting at 9 out of 10 missions in case I want to switch back and do a civ mission. Which sucks because I can't take any other missions like beacon flipping. Just another example of a game mechanic that henders short-time based playing.

[Tritian]

very good and valid points net and SS. Some things that might be realistic end up just hindering game play. Jumpgate is full of examples, such as the FF recharge thing, no docking at faction stations, and very strict bounty system.

I can foresee the AI system being equally devastating to game play, if they don't do it right. Like everything, it's all a dangerous balancing act where the tolerances are not very large.

[Algore]

Originally Posted by GrimGriz

Why WOULD a faction at war with you allow you to dock anywhere in their space? That'd be stupid. Buy your purgs from an octavian arms reseller.

Or better still just don't buy purgs at all as they have been utterly crap for the last 2 years at least. Get HR's or Still's in Oct where they are made.

[Jonboy]

Originally Posted by GrimGriz

Why WOULD a faction at war with you allow you to dock anywhere in their space? That'd be stupid. Buy your purgs from an octavian arms reseller.

PvPers forced to interact with haulers for their equipment? The horror! However, PvPers should make enough money to actually do this.

I agree with SS that you should be able to have the old launch/dock/launch shenigans, as they were fun as hell. But you'll remember that people like Rollio used to be based at QC while he launched, griefed and docked. It is realistic that a faction would stop you in their territory while you are there to fight. I also think that with POS, we were able to refresh too easily. This way seems to force you to mount a serious operation to attack your enemy.

This is, however, where I see a role for capital ships. Cap ships should be mobile launch platforms, from which you can dock and launch in enemy space... like Battlestar Galactica, or even better like Battle Beyond the Stars (1980). This would allow you the same refresh tactics, but it would still be a major investment for you to mount an invasion.

I don't know what to do about casual play.